The Baby Name Wizard

Question unrelated to this post: I was just thinking about how there are variations of J-vowel-N names with every vowel sound except two.

Jan, Jane, John, Joan, Jen, Jean, June, and Gin... all of which can also have an ie or y ending attached.

The only two that don't exist as standard names are Jine and Jun, which also don't seem to start any names a la Jennifer or Jonathan.

When I try to think of other names that are spelled/sound like J-vowel-consonant, all I can think of are the following:

Job, Jim, Jill, Jobe, Joel, Jeff, Jed, Jeb, Jess.

Almost none of the J-blank-consonant names exist with more than one vowel sound in between the J and N. (The only ones I can think of are Joel/Jill and Job/Jobe). I'm sure I'm missing some variations (which?), but I'm curious about this phenomenon. What makes J-blank-N so pleasing to our ears, or why is that the combination that history seems to have given us? I'd love to hear your thoughts!

*in the last paragraph, I meant "between the J and the consonant"

Ooh, I always loved the Betsy-Tacy books and thought Tacy was such a cute name! And Tib, their other friend, was short for Thelma, as I recall.

The only Griffith I know is a girl. She was named for her father (it is his middle name.) Her twin is Courtney (named after her aunt.)

I taught a Brooks two years ago, and know a boy named Davis. I like both of those names, and I can see Anders as a first name (like Anderson better.)

In another last-name pair, my friend named her twins Hogan (boy, her mother's maiden name) and Hayden (girl). I didn't really like Hogan at first b/c of my association with Hulk Hogan/Hogan's Heroes and dislike of Logan as a name, but it's growing on me. I do like Hayden. It's not a family name, though. She picked it b/c it went well with Hogan.

I always thought Harper and Hadley would be a nice literary set as sisters.

Although I wouldn't use a last name as a first name, I do like some of them when other people use them.

Arlene-thanks for the reminder about the painting! For those who suggested Marguerite-I love it. But I think dh will consider it too "exotic". He's pretty Wonder Bread when it comes to names he likes. I'm pretty sure he won't go for Genevra has a fn, which is why I'm pretty sure it'll just be a mn. I think that's why I haven't given nn's for Genevra much of a thought beyond the obvious (oh, and I do like Eva, but feel it may be a little too popular.)

LKB: Jack and Jake! Joss and Josie is close, too.

I was amused to see "Redmond" on the list. When we were trying to think up baby names, 'way back when, we'd go through Seattle neighborhoods and suburbs as possibilities.

Examples for girls: Madrona, Latona, Magnolia, Ravenna
For boys: Redmond, Renton, Fremont, Kent, even Wallingford

Not recommended for anyone: White Center, Puyallup, Squawk

You could probably do the same for where you live.

re: Junia as only female apostle. I think many scholars agree that Priscilla and Aquilla were also apostles, although Junia (sometimes translated as Julia or Junias) was very clearly so.

Ham is a Biblical name, being one of Noah's son's, along with Shem and Japeth.

It's really a shame that one cannot help but think of sandwich meat when one hears the name. It would be quite nice otherwise. Evocative of Sam & Cam but without the androgynous effects of Samantha and Cameron, having the more masculine "flavor" of Harry & Hank. Alas, poor Ham, you could have been a fine name. Although, Hammie is the nick-name for little Hamish in the cartoon Baby Blues, so maybe Ham is not without hope.

Hamish is pronounced HEY-mish right? So Hammie is HEY-mee?

I have met a couple of Hamilitons nn Ham over the years.

As for the "J-vowel-N" missing names, I have had Koren students by the names of Jinny and Jun.

I also can't imagine how annoying in must be to be a Tacy in a world semi-full of Traceys.

All this talk of June Jan Jo Jen reminds me of a name I came across a few years ago: Juno

She was a uber-trendy girl (only 5) from a well to do family, sisters were Mira and Jolie.

I kinda like it.

Thee's a glamour model in the Uk called Caprice, so it feels like a tacky name to me.
Juna - how about Djuna, name of a character in a Woody Alen film . I also knowa (Dutch) Djanu.

Any boy called Beckham would be assumed to be named after David Beckham in England.

As far as I know Nimrod is not unusual in Israel, also Elon and Adina. I have a cousin called Elan.

By the way, a great birth announcement in the Daily Telegraph today. The family is called Gash and the baby is Isadora Kallisto Drinkall gash, sister to Camilla, Phoebe, Oliver, hector, Xanthe, Francesca, Aloysius and Beatrice.

There was also a family called Morgan who'd had Monty Oscar Inigo - a brother for Maximilian and Poppy.

Djuna's not just a character in a Woody Allen film; the name's most famous carrier is Djuna Barnes (1892-1982), an American writer. Fun naming fact: her paternal grandmother's first name was Zadel.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Djuna_Barnes

Did you hear that Salma Hayek just named her daughter? Valentina Paloma. I love it! I graphed Valentina; it has been on the rise. Looks like it's going to keep rising.

re: Juno: I have a friend with this ln and I was thinking it would be a cool fn too.

There is a local physician whose first name is Bonzo. Even though he's a wonderful man, I have trouble getting past his name. Bonzo didn't even make the list of one-hit wonders!

Oh, hee hee I am home drunk on sugar and red dye #2 from a toddler's birthday party and all I could do when I saw that list was giggle immaturely: Chestina and Hosey! Shelvie and Sank! Loda and Bunk!

I had a great-great aunt Neely, nn'd from Cornelia, for whatever that's worth. And hey, I knew a Claiborne in high school, who was apparently way ahead of/behind his time.

Singleton would be a very odd last-name-turned-first these days. Perhaps a name for a child who miraculously appeared solo despite tons of fertility drugs, like my daughter?

My favorites from the list were Beckham & Channing. But I agree with Keren, Beckham would always be associated with David Beckham. (And I'm not a soccer fan.)

Alissa: I like "Genevra" better, because of the similarity to "Genevieve." "Ge" sounds softer to me than "Gi."

Love Griffith! I knew a Griffith years ago and actually, he was kind of an icky boy but that doesn't ruin the name for me. Griffin, I think, is also cute. Beckham's nice too; I like the name Beck but could only come up with Beckett before, which I'm not too big a fan of.

And to the person way up above looking for 'Win' names, I absolutely recommend Winston. Not too popular, but very nice and masculine.

On the J thing: not on the J-vowel-n thing, but a random comment - why is it that a j in the middle of a name looks odd? Like... well, I can't think of one, but that's kind of my point!

And on Salma Hayek's baby: Valentina Paloma is so cute! A variation on Valentina - Valenzia - was just born to my neighbors. They were thinking of Valentia, but when they tested it out, a lot of people (including me) had trouble with the -tia so they switched to the easier -zia.

What do you think about Everest (pron Ev-rest, like the mountain)? I remember somebody on here saying that they see colors with names. I never do, but for some reason I see dark green with Everest (even though mt everest is white). Maybe it's the evergreen sound association. I was thinking of Everett, but I think I like Everest better.

About no J's in the middle of names: I think it's because the English language doesn't generally put J's in the middle of words. The exceptions are words that got built using prefixes, like "adjudicate," or foreign words, like "pajama."

I am in Australia and went to school with an Adina. I have also come across a female Perry through work (she would be in her 40's).

I love Griffith for a boy but sadly could never use it as our surname ends in 'th' and the poor boy would permanently sound like he has a lisp.
Griffin is in play still but I prefer Griffith. I also love Xanthe for a girl but have the same issue with the 'th'. At least it's not right at the end with Xanthe.

Marjorie?

Is there a way to have both your baby girl's names (first and middle) be feminine and womanly or do you have to "balance" - say if the FN is Hunter the MN has to be Rose or if the FN is Marie the MN has to be Taylor.

JC- If you want your baby girl to have two traditionally feminine names, just give them to her! Semi androgynous names at any point in a girl's name are much rarer than traditionally feminine names. I'd say a more common balancing point is length of names.

And not related to anything but my own curiosity, who can give me an opinion on the most traditional spelling of the name Anneliese? Do I have it right?

(I always think it's funny when I respond to you - looks like you're talking to yourself :)). I had an Anneliese in my class several years ago, spelled that way. She pronounced it ON-uh-leese. Her mother said that was the traditional German spelling. It's pretty, but I had an Annalise as well (ANNA-leese, so it was a bit confusing.

Philippa, I think of Anneliese as the most traditional, which I think is the German/Dutch spelling, but I really have no idea... do they spell it the same way in both Germany and the Netherlands? Anyway, I like Anneliese better than Annalise. I do prefer the ON-uh-leese pronunciation over the AN-uh-leese, but both are pretty.

JC, of course you don't "have" to give your daughter any names that aren't traditionally feminine! I think that Philippa is right, that it is still more common for a girl to have two traditionally feminine names than not. Just give your daughter a name that you love!

For me, balancing traditional fem./masc. names in one person's name isn't generally an issue, but it can become more problematic in sibling name sets. For instance, to choose some random names: a girl named Clark Emiliana would sound fine to me, as would an Isabel Emiliana or a Clark Ryan. I would hesitate about sisters named Clark and Emiliana... not to say I couldn't get past my hesitation.

Yikes not much time to post but I just wanted to say thanks Keren for the Telegraph name update - what a set of names young Isadora has! I mean 'drinkall' - what's all that about?!

Oh and J&H's mum: I have to say (though I surprise myself) that I really like Shepard too! (and I'm just a little bit in love with the idea of Banks on a little boy - sooo cute!)

I know a man in his upper 30s named Shepard who goes by Shep - what's nice is that he can be known on a first-name basis, which is fairly rare these days.

JC: I think people generally worry about balancing androgynous and more feminine names when they want to use an androgynous one but feel they should use a more feminine mn so that the child could use both (professionally, for example) to indicate that she is a she.

I've never done this before, but found some interesting stuff in my hometown birth listings this week:
INDIANNA: mn makes me think this is a girl, wonder if they were trying for the nn Anna, also maybe another case of being able to use a place name if you are far from the place.

EXODUS: wow. very interesting Bible-inspired name.

HOGAN: someone else mentioned hearing this name. think it's back in our heads because of the Hulk Hogan reality show?

JAYVIN: new variation on Jayden is my guess. i kind of like the v sound.

ZIAN: as a mn, for a boy i think.

NIYAH: girl, variant on Nia?

I thought I'd share a list of births at a local hospital. I love reading all of your lists!
Dylan
Emma
Hanna
Maryam
Bryce
Daniel
Kaden
Madeline
Olivia
Jackson
Austin
Ryan
Atlas
Isabel
Izabella
Luke

And an acquaintance of mine just had a baby named Babette Virginia - I thought I'd share, as it fits into both the older names category and the Virginia discussion. In her case, both names are family names - Babette, her grandmother, and Virginia, her mother.

I thought I'd share some more names, too:
Shukiya Lynn
Christina Marie
Savannah Danielle
Benjamin Matthew

It's true that some Bible translations use "Junias" instead of "Junia", but they tend to be either older Roman Catholic translations or newer ultra-conservative Protestant ones. The King James version, often still revered by conservative Protestants, uses Junia.

It's true that many scholars regard Priscilla and Aquila as being apostles or the equivalent, but only Priscilla was a woman. Aquila was a man and Priscilla's husband:

http://www.biblequestions.org/Archives/BQAR387.htm

It's odd that it's Greely that makes the top 1000 list for one year, since this is probably an alternative spelling for Greeley, inspired by the famous editor and politician Horace Greeley. Greeley and Greenlee may sound alike, but they have different origins as surnames, the former mostly from an Old French word meaning "pock-marked" and the latter from a place name. Greenlee is considered a feminine name in the USA today mostly because of a character on the TV soap opera "All My Children."

Lili, in your list of fairly run-of-the-mill names, the name Atlas really stands out! I thought of using the name Atlas, but what if you end up with a skinny kid? A guy named Atlas with a slight build just wouldn't seem right!

It's funny you say that about Atlas - I could see a skinny, sort of intellectually curious Atlas who loved learning about the world.
I decided to put the more "normal" names on there just for context, so we don't think all names are so "out there."

Keren - I came across that Isadora announcement in the Telegraph, too. I actually had to read it several times to soak up all the oddities (and I mean, HOW many kids??). And let me share another tip, I also like to read the death announcements (a bit strange I know). Not only for the sometimes really nice "old/old-fashioned" names of the deceased, but also when the whole family who mourns them is listed - that gives you a nice impression of the names and naming trends for each generation.
Good Lors, I hope I don't sound too weird here, having pleasure in reading the death announcements!

What do people think of Virginia?

I want to honour Southern heritage but am not sure how to do it without people using the "Southern Belle" as a weapon.

JC - there was a big conversation about Virginia recently. I'm blanking on which post it was under, but I'm sure someone else on here will remember. I'd suggest taking a look at it for some thoughts.

JC - I found the Virginia thread, it's under "This Landon's Your Land."

Liston was the young lady teaching my daughter's swim class at the YMCA here in the S.F. Bay Area this past summer.

JC - Georgia is a great Southern name that seems to be currently in vogue. (I think Gigi would be a cute nn). I don't know what part of Southern heritage you would like to honor, so I am not sure if Georgia fits the bill.

Other Southern ideas: a double name, a lesser known place name than Virginia, a name like Scarlett that calls up images of the South (Gone with the Wind) but has other associations as well

Philippa- I'm from Germany, and it's traditionally spelled Anneliese.

I wouldn't use this name, simply because the "e" ending in both "Anne" and in "liese" is impossible for English speakers to say correctly.

And as to the "one-hit-wonder" names mentioned above-- my daughter (1 y.o.) is Simona. It was a name I'd heard on a Romanian gymnast when I was little and have loved it since. And to the person who enquired, we pronounce it "Si-moan-a" in English (and, more-or-less, Zee-mohn-a in German). Avoids the whole "ends in a non-silent e" pronunciation difficulty for Americans that Simone would have presented.

Just to clarify- Not saying anyone else shouldn't use Anneliese- it's beautiful- I just personally wouldn't use it. :-)

LKB - I'm sorry you found Virginia a poor name - I'm glad you respect those who are Christian though. It was a popular name once and arguably still beautifull - but now maybe wouldn't work in a world that is much more secular as you said and also today virginity is no longer seen as the important thing it was in more religious times. I was born and raised in the Buckle of the Bible Belt and many religious values are still with me as a result

C & C's Mom: Georgia could work with the right middle name - same with Caroline/Carolina?

Any more suggestions/help would be good

JC - I do agree that Virginia sounds beautiful, I just don't like the associations I make with it... I also really like Genevra/Ginevra from above, which sounds similar to me. And I think of Genevieve as a similar name, as I mentioned above - very elegant and classically feminine, and sounds a bit southern to me. I second the ideas of Georgia and Caroline/Carolina. To keep going with the place names, how about Augusta, Charlotte, Alexandria, or Savannah? Susannah, Grace, Gloria, Victoria, and Samantha all sound mildly southern to me, and perhaps one of them would complement one of the place names nicely. Also, maybe Adelaide, Nell, Priscille/a, Camille/a, or Felicity? I always throw in Felicity b/c it's one of my favorites, but I don't think I'd ever use it myself. Another one of my favorites: Isannah. I don't know if I'm on the right track here, maybe you can tell us more about your style? I hope some of that was helpful!

"O.H., thanks for the info on Nimrod. I have always wondered how a Bible king got changed into a complete idiot."

If I remember right, Nimrod was kind of a biblical villian no? Built a tower tall enough so he could shoot an arrow at God? I can imagine with that background, it was an insult before Bugs Bunny.

also, on mildly southern names, how about Esme?

Cecelia or Margareta could work as well.