The Baby Name Wizard

"Laura, I'm wondering how (if) you can make all those sibling suggestions mesh together. Eg., if Sylvie's sister could be Noelle, then would Sylvie have to be a suggestion for Noelle too?"

Great question! The "siblings" don't have to be reciprocal -- which is a very good thing. That's what lets you keep following a trail of interesting names throughout the book, rather than going in circles. Here's an abstract way of thinking of it, if you can bear with me:

Think of all the names as points in multidimensional space. Tzbit is right next to Pbluk in Dimension 21, so I list Tzbit as a brother to Pbluk to reflect Pbluk's characteristic 21-ness. But when it comes to Tzbit, dimensions 3,4 and 19 are more distinctive so names close in those dimensions get the nod.

Wow, that was truly terrible.

How about this: A is an unusual name with few close neighbors. B is at least semi-close, so it's chosen. But on the *other* side of B are C,D,E & F -- all much closer to B than A is.

OK, it's clearly time for some coffee!

"Brothers: Malik, Kofi, Kwame, Jelani, Khalid
Comments: In the end, I decided to go mostly with East African names that are uncommon but somewhat familiar in the West."

Just to point out, Kwame and Kofi are West African names, not East African. Indeed both are Akan. I know Laura used the qualifier "mostly" East African, but one of my pet peeves is seeing Africa as one huge monolith. It's a big continent with many, many cultures and many. many languages, and they are not fungible, any more than European languages and cultures are. If we were looking to match an Eastern European name, we wouldn't suggest Kelly and Delphine, would we?

Now, say, an African-American couple had a little Barack and were expecting a second son. They might well be interested in names of African political figures, and Kofi and Kwame would certainly fit the bill, as would Nelson and Robert and Idi (not that anyone in his/her right mind would want to honor Robert Mugabe and Idi Amin). But Kofi and Kwame are not east African names from the Muslim community there, as is Barack.

Oooh, the Jolie Pitt twins are here: Knox Leon and Vivienne Marcheline.

Knox...on can only imagine the two of them going though every possible word ending in x to match Maddox and Pax.

Elisabeth posted on her baby name blog (http://youcantcallitit.com) that Knox is the middle name of Brad's grandfather Hal Knox Hillhouse. Wasn't that a lucky coincidence to have a significant male name ending in ' x ' waiting for them?!

When I mentioned the name Knox to my husband, a historian, he immediately exclaimed at what a distinguished name it is, recalling John Knox, the Scottish religious reformer and founder of the Presbyterian church in Scotland. When I heard Knox, the name of the 11th president of the United States James Knox Polk immediately came to mind. I checked on his name, and learned that Knox was the maiden name of President Polk's mother, who was a descendant of the great John Knox. Surely the name Knox outranks his brother's names in stature, and I can see this name being taken up again, as it was in the 19th century.

Thank you Miriam! I have the same pet peeve. I did an African Studies minor in college, so the idea of Kwame as "East African" jumped out at me as so obviously *wrong*.

As you say, it's conceivable that a family would still choose names from various African cultures (just as Kelly, Astrid, and Roxanne might be sisters), but they should *know* that they are drawing from a very diverse range of origins.

On Knox--I know the Presbyterian Knox, and James K. Polk, but all the name conjured for me was Knox Gelatin. Ah well! Maybe he'll be called Leon, the French part of his name, to match his twin's French names, and the place they were born.

"Barack Obama has an African name."

Um, Barack and Hussein for that matter are Arabic names, that is, SW Asian, not African. They are usable and used throughout the Muslim world, whether in Pakistan or Indonesia or Saudi Arabia or Iraq or East or West Africa. There is nothing particularly African about them.

Many African-Americans choose Arabic names, either because they are Muslims or because for some reason they identify with Arab culture or with famous people from the Arabic/Islamic world or simply because they like the sound--many Arabic names, especially for women, are indeed mellifluous. Or for whatever other personal reason. In Barack Obama's case, the reason was obviously familial. But that does not make Arabic names African. Cassius Clay assumed the name Mohammed Ali when he became a Muslim, but I don't think anyone would therefore claim that Mohammed and Ali are African names. My understanding is that, in fact, Mohammed is the most common given name in the world. Nonetheless it is still Arabic.

Barack Obama's father was a Luo, and I assume (without being absolutely certain) that Obama is a Luo name. So if anyone wants African, there it is. If Arabic is wanted, go for Khalid or Malik. If it is a matter of honoring African political figures, then it's Kofi or Kwame. The only one of the suggested male names that is east African is Jelani which is Swahili.

Not to be misunderstood, any of those names would be fine for a Barack brother as would a whole host of other names. Barack and Michelle Obama themselves did not look to either Africa or the Muslim world in naming their own children. Elder daughter Malia Ann was, I have heard, named after an Indonesian bird (and what could be more unremarkable in the US than Ann as a middle name), and younger sister Natasha (Sasha) has a Slavic name.

Sister Melinda, Knox Gelatin (invented by Charles Knox in 1890) didn't come to mind when I heard the name Knox, and I haven't heard any reference to Knox Gelatin for many years. It always seems to depend on one's associations with a name. For me, Knox sounds distinguished.

Miriam, I've read that Malia is a Hawaiian name; Ann was for Senator Obama's mother Stanley Ann Dunham, who was called "Ann" as an adult. Natasha, as you say, is of Slavic origin; Laura noted it's style as African-American in "Wizard". So both names seem to relate to the Obama's experiences. And of course, there is no reason to think that Barack and Michelle Obama would look for a Muslim name for their daughters, as they are devout Christians.

I love Amelie, Iris, and all the brothers for Sylvie. I think Leonie, Noelle, and Lucie are a bit matchy for my taste, though. Noelle seems out of place since all the Noelle I know are in my age group (mid-20s) and Sylvie, to me, is a stylish young name. Though, as noted by readers, it is seen as much older in parts of Canada.

I think of Barack as a biblical name. (Barak) So i think great brother names to be Ezra, Isaac, and Ezekiel. But i think i may be the only one.

I'm coming a bit late to the party, but for some reason, in my mind, the name Walter goes really well with Sylvie. Is it just me?

As Patricia noted, Natasha was chosen as an African-American name not a Slavic name. Obama sons could easily be Antonio, Demetrius and Jerome with no incongruity whatsoever.

Malia is a great culture-mix name, pulling together Hawaiian and AfAm influences. I would expect the name Barack to show up mixed culture families as well, so sibling names could reflect AfAm, Hawaiian, heartland Chicago-style, African, Arabic, Jewish, Christian and other influences.

If I named my firstborn Barack, the next two would probably be Moses and Ruby (as in Ruby Bridges).

I really appreciate your sibling matches, mainly for the third reason you gave: showing parents how the name will "look" to others. We choose "Jameson" for our son, mainly to get "James" while avoiding "Jim", but your book was a good reminder to us that Jameson is not a traditional name, and choosing sibling names is going to be more challenging for it.

Whoa, looks like I'm going to have to go back and tweak the Barack comments! :-) I did say "mostly" East African for a reason. Kofi and Kwame were chosen as names with political connotations, and Malia for the Senator's daughter. Clearly the "mostly" wasn't enough, I'll edit to clarify.

Also, to the comment that Barack is simply a Muslim name with "nothing particularly African" about it, that doesn't fit my understanding of the name. While Barack/Baraka comes from an Arabic root, I believe it's most common in East Africa and strongly associated with that region. Am I wrong?

Thanks!

"Laura, I'm wondering how (if) you can make all those sibling suggestions mesh together. Eg., if Sylvie's sister could be Noelle, then would Sylvie have to be a suggestion for Noelle too?"

Great question! The "siblings" don't have to be reciprocal -- which is a very good thing. That's what lets you keep following a trail of interesting names throughout the book, rather than going in circles. Here's an abstract way of thinking of it, if you can bear with me:

Think of all the names as points in multidimensional space. Tzbit is right next to Pbluk in Dimension 21, so I list Tzbit as a brother to Pbluk to reflect Pbluk's characteristic 21-ness. But when it comes to Tzbit, dimensions 3,4 and 19 are more distinctive so names close in those dimensions get the nod.

Wow, that was truly terrible.

How about this: A is an unusual name with few close neighbors. B is at least semi-close, so it's chosen. But on the *other* side of B are C,D,E & F -- all much closer to B than A is.

OK, it's clearly time for some coffee!

Update on the Quads.
Apparently I got it wrong and there is one boy and 3 girls, not 4 girls.

My friend was wondering if Codex could be used as a name, or would the general public find it too weird? Would everyone call him Cody?

>>My friend was wondering if Codex could be used as a name, or would the general public find it too weird?<<

I would say no, because it's too close to Kotex. What does she like about "Codex" that makes her consider it?

@ Trish: I think it's the trendy 'X'. And the 'dex' sound. We offered Dexter, but she hates it.

I've lived in the Arab world (Qatar) for four years without meeting a Barack, but everyone here would certainly recognize it as an Arabic name. I have met several Mubaraks, though, and a Mabrook; they're all close synonyms.

Laura--

I think you and I are coming from different perspectives about Barack. You are classifying it as east African because you think (and you may be right for all I know) that it is more common among east African Muslims than among Muslims elsewhere. I classify it as Arabic because it is an Arabic word/name. It is not derived from any of the indigenous languages of east Africa or indeed anywhere else in Africa. Arabic is a Semitic language along with Hebrew and Aramaic, and these languages are all indigenous to SW Asia. Semitic belongs to the Afro-Asiatic language family, all the other branches (Cushitic, Berber, Ancient Egyptian, etc.) of which are indigenous to North Africa.

Many African-Americans have chosen Swahili names for their children, and Swahili is indeed an east African lingua franca used by Luo, Kikuyu, Masai and other east African peoples when they wish to communicate outside their own tribal/linguistic group. When I was in grad school, for a while I hung out with a group of Kenyan students, colleagues of a fellow I knew from my undergrad days. They spoke English of course and Swahili across tribal lines. With their own tribemates they spoke Kikuyu, Luo, or Masai (I think there was only one Masai, so maybe he kept his mouth shut). I was unable and unwilling to cope with their tribal politics, so I didn't hang out with them very long.

In any case the overwhelming majority of African-Americans do not have any Swahili-speaking, East African heritage. They are descended from the Senegambian peoples of West Africa, and their forebears spoke Yoruba, Igbo, Hausa, Mandingo, and other west African languages.

As I noted before, Americans typically tend to lump all African cultures and languages together, although in fact they are at least as distinct as European languages and cultures, in fact much more so. Almost all European languages are Indo-European (with the exception of Magyar, Finnish, Estonian, and Basque), while there are something like 2000 indigenous African languages, generally grouped into four main language families (with some controversy as to what goes where), not to mention non-African languages which are nonetheless spoken in Africa (Arabic, English, French, Afrikaans, Spanish, Portuguese, some Indian languages, etc.)

So, as you noted in the first place, finding names compatible with Barack is a vexed issue that very much depends on the reason(s) for choosing Barack in the first place. And if the choice of Barack is partially influenced by Amiri Baraka(born LeRoi Jones), as in some families it might well be, that's another kettle of fish, so to speak. (So maybe Amir would be another sib possibility from another perspective.)

I meant to ask this before--have any of you who follow birth announcements from newspapers, online hospital listings, etc., seen newborns being named Barack? If so, have you noticed any patterns in the names of siblings and parents?

Knox really says "largest gold depository in the world" to me, but that's probably because I live next door to Ft. Knox.

Is it just me, or did Angelina run out of unusual names this time? Marcheline wasn't really a surprise, but Vivienne, even though she didn't spell it Vivian, is still a trendY name, not trend-setting.

But I love Leon and Vivienne, so I'm happy, even if she didn't come up with Lexington or Perryville or something.

Eimi: Codex instantly made me see a Rolex fused with a Kodak. And yes, Kotex is way too close. Would she like to call him Dex?

I like the Barack sibs. I dont quite feel the Sylvie sibs, but then I am not familiar enough with the French and the Sylvie I know is preppy, urban and a bit edgy.
Good Work, Laura.

@Jessica: She does like nicknames at all. She thinks you should just call your kid what your going to call them. She just likes the sound of Dex.

Oops. I meant that to say she does NOT like nicknames at all. :)

A codex is a book with pages as opposed to a scroll. I just can't see that as a name. Why not just name the child Dex? That's no more out there than Pax and IMO less out there than Codex. None of these names is my style, but that's irrelevant.

I'm so proud to get noticed with my first comment here , suggesting Leonie! LUV yr book & this site.

@ Miriam

I think she would but she doesn't think it goes well with the names of the 3 other girls (which change from hour to hour but currently are: Adrienne, Mishay, Sofiah [pronounced: soh-fye-ah])

Do you think Dex would go with those names?

Laura, I'm excited to see you got your sibsets out of this. I love the Kingston sister names most of all. They fit perfectly, especially Indigo, Marley, and Juno. I worry a little about Harlow and Winter both being names of Nicole Ritchie's daughter (Harlow Winter Kate Madden) giving that one person a bit too much sway over the list, though!

Codex is one of the worst names I've ever heard. Is that too mean? I would never say that to someone who introduced me to their just-born son, Codex, but if asked (even indirectly) for my opinion, I have to say that I just don't like it. I like Dex, Dax, even Pax or Knox better. And thinking of sibsets, Lucia and Codex sound like they're from different planets, let alone families. Maddox sounds similar to Codex with the advantage of not being entirely awful. And after pimping out Brangelina's entire roster of boys' names, I'm going to stop before I hurt myself.

Hi, this is Laura. My profound apologies to Eo, I accidentally erased her message in an attempt to reply to it. Administrator privileges are a dangerous thing!

Part of what she wrote was...

"Gosh, there HAVE to be alternatives to Codex..."

...to which I say: Calix, anyone?

I think Codex would be a great sibling match for Cadence, though!

Lennox (that was my original vote for the Jolie-Pitt kid)? Colfax? Koufax, for the baseball history buff? Halifax, for some Canadian chic? Onyx? Paxton? Rex?

Using Codex without realizing that it's a very familiar word to historians and librarians and other scholars would really not reflect well on the parents--and would become a hassle for the kid. Not even touching the Kotex homonym...

Eimi--

What kind of name is Mishay? I am not familiar with it. Does Codex go with those names? I don't see why Dex would be any the worse.

No problem, Laura, what I wrote was rather banal compared to all these great "-x" suggestions coming in!

Eimi -- Another vote against Codex. If she likes Dex, she should just use that. I do know someone whose son is Declan (nn Dex), but if your friend doesn't like nns (and I'm not sure how she'd feel about an Irish name), then that's likely out.

Sister Melinda -- I thought of Knox gelatin, too! You're not alone.

Eimi:

I know this isn't Codex.. or the name Dex for that matter but has she considered Drake.. it sounds similar and I think fits well with the names she is considering at the moment.

@ sushi: those are great suggestions I'll be sure to bring them up!

@ Miriam: She got the name from a french-canadian man (named Mishay) who kept callin my father's house. (my father was complaining about him in the presence of my friend). I'm not sure how the man spells his name, so my friend just decided to go with it phonetically.

I lived in East Africa for 6 years--largely in Kenya and Tanzania. I did not live in majority Islam regions and I knew several non-Muslim Barakas, of different age groups. I never met a Malik, a Jelani, a Kofi or a Kwame but can see the last two as plausible given their political connotations. I have met Khalids but in that case I think of it as distinctly Arabic.

Swahili is a creole language of mostly Bantu and Arabic origin--but it is more than a lingua franca. Its the mother-tongue of most everyone along the EA coast, with its own literature and history. Historically it reached its highest levels on the Islamic coast but it goes deep inland now. In EA they say Swahili was born on the coast, grew up in Tanzania, got sick in Kenya and died in Uganda. As a lingua franca its now found all the way into Eastern Congo, well past its surmised death in Uganda.

I think I'm babbling here but I wanted to say that Baraka is essentially a word name in Swahili, and it seems very different to me than many other Arabic names, despite the linguistic roots.

Question: Do Arabic names frequently involve words names? as in analogous to being Lily or August or Blue? Its pretty common among many African languages, across the continent, and its how I see Baraka. Arabic names (to me at least) appear to not be word names, but I don't really know b/c I don't speak Arabic. But Swahili is a lot like English, absorbing names and words from all over. It doesn't necessarily make Barack less East African to have roots in Arabic.

I just found a fairly entertaining blog post (in Swahili) laughing at how Americans use (and then shorten) East African names. Baraka to Barack to Barry fell into that category.

Obama is a Luo name.

I know this post keeps going on and on but I've spent the day immersed in Swahili texts and films so its much on my mind.

I did a search and found a snippet on Barack Obama's name from CKE. He cites the source of Barack as Barakat.

The Swahili version of BARAKAT is Baraka, and Barack is an Anglicized Kenyan version of Baraka. So this is the origin of Barack Obama's first name, not the Hebrew Barak.
-- clevelandkentevans 6/11/2008

So, this would imply an unrelated? African root for Barack, as well as an Arabic one.

I cannot think of a French name that sounds anything like Mishay, but simply based on the French language I can tell you that it almost certainly ends with "é", not "ay", and that in French the "sh" sound is made with "ch", so the most likely spelling of a name sounding like Mishay would be Miché.

(The above information is for interest only... I'm not suggesting that this more French spelling would be a particularly good name. I wonder whether this is a nickname or something because it really sounds like no name I have ever encountered.)

Also, just for the record, while Sylvie might be a middle-aged name to me, I haven't met any children named Arthur.

Oh, one more thing is that, while I didn't think of it myself, I was really rooting for the name Frederick for Sylvie's brother because when I read that suggestion it just felt so perfect.

Another vote against Codex. Waaaay too much like Kotex.

And a vote against Mishay too. (I'm thinking this might originally be Michel? Maybe?) It seems a little odd that she's thinking about naming one of her precious babies after an annoying French-Canadian man whose name she doesn't even really know.

Could you try to narrow down her "style"? Or does she not have one (maybe the reason why she's having so much trouble)?

i like vivienne jolie-pitt. it's the classiest celebrity baby name in a long time. knox...not too crazy about this one. i hear noxious or obnoxious...so it's unpleasant to my ear.
my darling 14 year old granddaughter who has gotten the "name enthusiast bug" from me, said tonight she finds that maddox, pax and knox sound a bit too repetitive...i agree.

Karyn--

I was thinking Michel for precisely the reasons you listed. The ending threw me too, but maybe it was lost in translation--from the French-Canadian mouth, to the English-speaking ear, to the English-speaking mouth? Who knows!

Anybody else out there have any ideas?

Michel is exactly what I was thinking, too. The only reason that I didn't include the guess was that their ending phonemes are so different: Michel's ending is soft and smoothe while the é is a much harder sound.

*Shrug*

It feels like the mother is desperately trying to find something that feels right and is willing to try anything.

Eimi-
Ah... Dexter was on the tip of my fingers from your first 2 sentences. :) Too bad, I am starting to like that one more (after years of thinking it was pretty "nerdy").
What about Maddox? Yes, she may be "accused" of copying the Jolie/Pitts, but it's still a cool name.

If your friend likes the letter 'x,' what about Xander? Or Xavier? Granted, neither of these makes the 'ex' sound, but both have that cool factor.

Alex? (Have a feeling that may be too common for her) Lex? (Makes me think of Lex Luther) Maddex/Maddox? Rex? Tex? (Had to throw that one in there!)

Axel? Baxter? Braxton? Jax/Jaxon? Max?

Lennox?

Huxley? (Makes me think of Dr. Huxtable on the Cosby Show)

Felix? Phoenix?

And...I'm spent. That's all I've got for right now.

a friend's sister is having her first child, a boy, due in september. she's already picked out the first name, Cason, but is stuck on the middle name.
she was thinking Cason Jeffrey, after her husband, but doesn't want him to be called CJ.
another idea of hers is Cason Payton. we're trying to talk her out of it.

does anyone have some suggestions for her?

Another Amy--thank you so much for your comment. I have just returned from Tanzania after living there for two years and it warmed my heart to read your comment!
Because I associate Barack with "baraka" (blessing), I think of it as a Swahili word name, too. While none of Laura's names sounded East African to me (with the exception of Jelani, although I never encountered anyone with that name in my time in East Africa), I don't think it is wrong to consider Barack an East African (Swahili) name despite its Arabic roots.
Anyway, you said it all better than I can, so I will end this comment here.
(Oh, I particularly loved that you included the maxim about Swahili's origin and death.)
Ulifanya kazi gani katika TZ na Kenya? Mimi nilifundisha shule ya secondari na nilifanya kazi kwa chuo ya Merikani katika Iringa, TZ.

It is fun to get a peek into people's backgrounds. Easternbetty--was is your connection to Africa?

Would she like Dax? Or Rex? Another vote against Codex anyway.

I'm excited that Indigo is in the new book as a girl's name. As I recall, the last edition only mentioned the name once, and it was as a boy. Now if I could just get Laura to see Phoenix as a girl's name too, or at least unisex. (In China, the Phoenix bird is the symbol of the Empress. Very feminine!)

At the same time, I hope Indigo doesn't get too popular. I would be a bit sad if the name hit the top 1000.

We never got a chance to name a boy, but I do like Kingston. That name, however, was out of the running for us because my *aunt* is named King. Unusual, but it works on her.

re Arabic word names/another Amy - off the top of my head, I used to work for a Ghada, who told me her name means 'gazelle'. And Warda/Ouarda means 'rose' so I'd say yes, word names in Arabic, at least for women, probably aren't too unusual.

re x names - why not Fox? I know a little boy named this because his mother wanted the x sound... The x-files connotation immediately leapt to mind for me, but won't for everyone...

Another strong vote against Codex here, for all the reasons already mentioned (I'm not sure *what* that goes with, except maybe sisters Index and Annex?). And yes, if she did go with Codex, I think most people would feel compelled to do the kid a favor and call him Cody, or at least Dex. As an earlier poster said, I wouldn't say any of this if introduced to a little Codex, but if the mom considering it is seriously looking for opinions on how the name will be received, I don't think it helps her to just nod and smile. I thought sushi and AK had some attractive alternatives for the X fans out there--I like Lennox for this quad set, especially. I'm not too crazy about Mishay, either, and I was also thinking it must've been Michel or something like it or a NN for something to that effect. How about Marcheline instead? lol.

I do think the new Jolie-Pitt names are nice. Knox is rather matchy and nms, but at least it's a strong name with some great history and even family connection. Vivienne is a bit frilly for me, but Viv is sassy enough to go with her sisters, and I do quite like Marcheline.

I like Laura's chosen sibling matches, mostly--they seem like they work, to me.