moonlady
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Emilyrae -- I don't post here all that much. But I thought I'd chime in since somebody here (don't remember who now) suggested the name we wound up using on my first son (Arieh, we call him Ari). Now I'm nearly 8 mo pregnant with son #2. I guess I haven't posted much since we've already decided on a name (Ronen, but we will NOT call him Roni or Ron for short, I only like the full name). I like that it's a modern non-biblical Israeli name that Americans can pronounce, but that it is similar to the Irish name Ronan (I have some Irish heritage). The Japanese version Ronin has an intriguing meaning too. So overall, except for the detested nicknames, Ronen is a win (it was our backup choice for Ari, who is now 20 mo old).
@Eustace -- how about Samson? It's definitely Jewish, but doesn't strike me as overly so (I could be wrong -- I don't know much about the religious Jewish community). It sounds like it should be popular but it isn't (#868 in 2010). It's easy to pronounce, and sounds a bit like Samuel.
I also suspect there's something in sales culture. It's far from my own world, but I'd be willing to bet there are a number of Rashids going by Ron and Logans going by Chip because they know that names like that help them to make a sale. Fifteen years ago I read through "Dress for Success for Women" and discovered that this sort of thing is common in clothing too. For example, an accountant mentioned in the book increased her clientele by wearing stodgier clothing -- apparently people think of reliable accountants as boring people, so fitting the stereotype helped her career. Why not do the same with a name?
My middle name is Kay, which is one of my mother's nicknames (she's a Kathleen). It's short and sweet and part of the flow -- my first and last names have two syllables, so it just works (DAH-duh dah DUH-duh). I didn't change my name when I got married so I've never had any legal issues with it. I'm not overly attached to the meaning or significance in the family though. But I do like that it's pronounced the same whether I spell it out or just use an initial. So I consider my "official" name to be DAH-duh K DUH-duh, with no period after the K (since it doesn't have to be an abbreviation). Yes, I'd fight for it! It's the only name I will ever have, and it's mine. The only person who ever actually called me by that name is my mother, who would angrily insert the middle name after the first when I was in trouble. :)
DH has vetoed Liora, which would be perfect since it's so close to my name. (I forget why he didn't like it.) Leah is biblical, and most of the others are not Israeli. We'd really like to stick to Israeli names -- she'd be getting my last name, so I'd like to make a concession to his culture. I still love Lilit though, although I wonder if there's a better spelling that would make more sense in English. Let me see: Lileet, Leeleet... no, they look stupid. (Tempted to go with Li1337, LOL.) Would Lilita be too close to Lolita? I don't know. I'll keep working on it.
@another Laura -- Teresa and Tommy Tyson sound like standard superhero secret identities. I say go for it! @Miriam -- I'm not Jewish at all, so carrying on the "L" in my name didn't even occur to me as odd. It doesn't seem to bother DH though. Unfortunately Talia won't work because he has a cousin with that name (she goes by Tali). On the general conversation -- To me, both the sound and the meaning have to make sense to me. It can't just be a pretty sounding name and it can't be a meaningful name I don't like (like Hermione). It has to work on all levels. I figure there are enough names out there that something can be worked out. That's why I'm a regular on this site!
I didn't know that Meredith could be a boy's name. But I guess that's true of a lot of names (Evelyn, Kimberly, etc.). In the US I think it would be a problem -- it's too much associated with girls. Worse, it doesn't have a masculine nickname that would help makeup for this (Merry is also too feminine). Unless there's a significantly different tradition in the UK, I'd stay away. I have my own baby name question. I'm pregnant with my 2nd now, and we're hoping for a girl this time, to be little sister to our boy Ari (short for "Arieh", which is Hebrew for lion). I have always loved the name Lilith or Leila. My grandmother's name was Leila. But I'm rather dismayed with the increasing popularity of Laila, Layla, Leila, Lilah, Delilah, and Lila (the list goes on). Lilith has some rather strong feminist connotations, which is fine, but it's a lot to saddle a little girl with, so I'm considering other options. (That said, I love the idea of naming my girl after the original tough lady ;)). My husband is Israeli and neither of us is religious. We prefer Israeli names that aren't biblical or out of date. They also have to be easily pronounced by Americans, and not sound too weird in American culture. I like the idea of passing along a name beginning with L, since I'm a Lori named from Lawrence named from Lawrence. It was here on this blog that I got the idea of Ari (thanks!), so I'm giving it another shot. The best I can come up with is Lilit (pronounced "Lee-LEET"), which is cute, Israeli, and not as immediately recognizable as being the same as Lilith. But nobody would know how to pronounce it (then again, nobody says Arieh correctly either, which is why we stick with Ari). Anybody have any other suggestions similar to Leila, Lilith, or Lilit?
All the names in the original post are male, how interesting. Now, is that because men are more numerous in sci-fi and fantasy stories? (Possibly, for example, I think two or three female characters are mentioned in The Hobbit but none have any lines, etc.) Or is it that their names just aren't as liked? Trillian, as mentioned above, is a good example. Another that comes to mind is Eowyn or Arwen. I don't see myself considering Hermione or Hedwig, though. And I don't think I'd use any of these names on my kids, male or female. Maybe a dog or cat, though. I almost named my two black cats Lestat and Louis, years ago.
I'm a Lori, born in the early 70s when it was a fairly popular name, named after my father Lawrence. I guess I never really loved or hated my name. The bad: It's not special, it's hard to make a nickname out of, and when I was younger grownups would ask if it was short for something like Lorraine (which thankfully it is not). When I say "special" I mean names like Kira or Celeste or Meera, like all those movie heroine types (seriously, I think every young heroine from the 1980s fantasy world was called some version of Kira/Kara -- why?). It's often misspelled and mispronounced (I'm LOR-ee, not LA-ree). If there's anything I don't like about it is that the name is a little cutsey. It's not the name that the tough girl (Max) or the smart girl (Amanda) or the cool girl (Jules) would have in a movie. Lori is the name of the soft girl in pink standing in the background. I once had a paper published in an international journal, and on googling myself found a blog where someone made fun of my name because it sounded like something a cheerleader would be named, rather than the scientist that I am. (Their problem, I think, don't you?) If first impressions count, then it would be nice for it to be one of my choice. The good: It comes from the Laurel leaves that crowned Olympic athletes and poets, so I like the meaning (who doesn't want to be a winner?). And my name could have been so much worse -- there were only 3 of us in my graduating class in high school. Also, it's hard to make fun of -- once the kids run through "sorry Lori" they usually can't think of anything else. It's simple and concise. Regardless, it's who I am, and it's mine. I dunno, maybe Laurel would be a little nicer and not have the "i" ending so common to frilly girl names. But Lori it is.
Interesting. My name is inbetween -- not unusual or overly common. On Facebook there are about 25 people with my first and last name (and a few others who have listed a second last name, presumably their married or maiden name). I've been lucky not to have had many problems with my name, so I find it all to be in fun. Who are these other people with my name and what are they like? Are they smarter than me? Prettier? Richer? About ten years ago I found out, while googling my name, that a character with my name is the star of a (soft core) romance novel. I'm not a fan of the genre but I had to have a copy. I emailed the author, who was tickled. I've also made sure, now that I know there are more of us out there, that when my name is googled, I am the first one on the list. I am a published scientist, and being easy to find is important in my field. Being known means a lot when your product is the papers you write (I suppose this is true for all authors). Will this make me a target in some other way? Maybe, but I need to be accessible to my colleagues.
Penny, that's a good idea. You're right, unfamiliar names are also ambiguous (to me, anyway). I'll use that from now on. It seems a little clumsy, but it's better to be clumsy than to offend someone.
I like androgynous names, they're kind of cool and refreshing for girls. And I'm glad that in a few cases at least they don't seem to be taking ground from the boys. Here's my question: with all the androgynous names, how will we address people over the internet if we don't know their gender? For example, I once received an email from someone named Dana, but I didn't know if it was a man or a woman. Since it was a formal email I felt the need to respond with a "Dear Ms." or Dear Mr.", but I wasn't sure what to do. If androgynous names become more common, there will have to be some way to address this problem. Or is there already an answer to this?
On feminine names and being judged in a male-dominated world: I've had it happen to me. My first name is clearly feminine (L0ri). A few years ago I published a paper in an international journal and got a little recognition for it. At some point I googled my own name (first and last) to see who else out there had my name, and I found a blog mentioning my article and my name. This blogger (young and female) seemed quite amused and bewildered, and maybe a bit upset, that women with such feminine "cheerleader"-like names had the audacity to become scientists. I suspect she knew a cheerleader with this name in high school (funny, in my high school class there were 3 L0ris, and none of us were anywhere close to being cheerleaders). I know the name comes across as soft and feminine, but I never knew people would also assume it meant I'm not ambitious or intelligent. So in some ways I can really understand wanting to name a girl something more androgenous -- it can be hard enough to get respect in some fields. If I have a girl I'll take a different angle and probably name her Lilith or something similar to it (which is a very feminine name, but she'll be named after the first feminist -- she wins both ways).
The French would pronounce Elodie like Melody, more or less (more like eh-low-dee), but sharing emphasis between all the syllables (something that makes French so very French). I like it, it flows nicely. Milena reminds me of Einstein's first wife, Mileva. Very pretty -- and a lovely and brilliant (if somewhat sad) woman. Armen makes me want to say "hammer". I suppose a popular kid could turn that to his advantage though. Callum makes me want to say "gollum", although I recognize it as a worthy Scottish name. I don't think I could use it.
Landry: When I should have been getting work done today, I looked up all of the variations of Lila on the Name Voyager to see how common they really are. Some of these will have different pronunciations, but that will vary with how the parents decide to spell them. As of 2008: Name, #/million, rank Lila, 430, #179 Lilah, 180, #411 Lyla, 340, #222 Layla, 1130, #155 Laylah, 58, #993 Laila, 550, #140 Lailah, 68, #870 Leila, 350, #226 Leyla, 87, #772 (there was no Leilah or Laylah I guess these are past #1000) Did I miss any? That's 3193 per million (ppm? LOL, I'm a geek), which is 0.3% of all newborn girls, or one out of every ~313 girls. All are rising in popularity, so these odds will probably go up, but even these combined variations still don't add up to very much. So it's unlikely that your Lila will be one of 5 in her kindergarten class (barring local variations that the Name Voyager doesn't account for). I think part of wanting to be different is the bombardment of books, movies, and TV shows with girls that have neat names. I remember lots of 1980s movies where the heroine was named Kara or Kira or something similar (anybody remember the Dark Crystal? http://www.imdb.com/character/ch0083234/), which immediately made me think my own name (in the top 20 in the 70s when I was born) was quite boring. I knew I'd want a really neat name for my kid that was pretty and clearly singled her out as a hero type (mind you, this was me thinking as an 8 year old). So it couldn't possibly be something as mundane as Mary or Jennifer or Jane, it would have to be something pretty but a little unusual. I guess that stuck with me. I wonder how many of us were affected by that. It just occurred to me, the Kara/Kira trend continues with Starbuck from the recent Battlestar Galactica series, whose name was Kara Thrace. Laura, you could write a whole blog entry on this female hero naming trend. When did it start and why? Why has it lasted so long?
Interesting ideas. I like most of what Laura says, but I do think that only a very small proportion of parents actually check statistics before choosing a name for their kids. I'm not sure how much this could influence naming trends, even if the data is out there for everyone to see. I'd guess that it's just one of several effects that has influenced naming (like cre8ive spelling, etc.), rather than the one big effect that rules the overall trend. I do know that my choice for a girl (although I'm currently pregnant with a boy) would be one of the variations of Lila/Lilah/Leila/Lyla/Laila. I watch with dismay as the names all grow in popularity with each passing year. But I love the name enough not to go with anything else (although sometimes I flip to Lilith/Lilit, which is very similar). So as unique as I'd like to be, I'm part of a trend anyway. I wonder why all the other parents are choosing this name, and if it's for similar reasons.
Thanks for doing this! I'm currently 6mo pregnant with kid #1. DH is Israeli and we'd like to give the kid an Israeli name (nonbiblical) that works in the US. Because of a suggestion on this blog I think we've settled on Arieh (shortened to Ari), which means "lion". I don't have a good feel for what's popular in Israel right now, so I'm relying on DH's opinion as to what's an "old man's" name versus something that's right for a little boy. It's hard to find good websites on Israeli names (most are biblical and aimed at American Jews, which isn't what we're going for -- Israeli Jews often have a very different outlook on life, as I've discovered). I did find one good one that sorts names by themes and even writes them out in Hebrew, but not by popularity. That would be really cool...
On the original topic: Actually my kids will have my last name (I'm female) and my husband's last name will be their second middle name. So not all children are "stuck" with their father's last name! It's not because he doesn't like his name, but rather that he has a horde of younger brothers -- whereas if I don't pass my last name on to the next generation it will be lost to this branch of the family. (Besides, this way I get to pass on my initials. I have the same initials as my father and his father, so it would be cute to pass them on to one of the kids.) As for choosing a first name, I suppose we fall into the typical couple where I'm the one doing all the research and he's the one suggesting preferences and vetoing the occasional idea. Not that I haven't vetoed a few of his, but he hasn't gone out of his way to make suggestions. It's true that having his input is important in getting him to help with raising the kids, it's one of the first big decisions we make about them. I expect him to do his share in raising them (both our careers will take a hit, not just mine). I don't like the older generation's attitude that the children and the kitchen are the woman's domain (both my mom and mother in law definitely have this attitude, although I don't think either is aware of it). I suppose in a way it's their version of women's lib: if the woman takes over some chunk of the household duties then she's the one in charge in those areas, if nowhere else. My version of women's lib is to share all those duties and negotiate my way through life, so that hopefully everything that needs doing gets done, somehow, by somebody. I have no doubt this will totally confuse the older generation, who will wonder why I'm allowing DH to change the diapers...
Mirnada I really love Penn Jilette's daughter's name, Moxie. It's adorable and has a wonderful, feisty meaning. This is also true of her middle name, CrimeFighter, but IMO it's a little out there (but hey, it's a middle name anyway).
Hmm, boys' names went all cutesy back during the Depression. But these days nobody wants to name their kid Zackie and instead call him Zackary, a more grownup name (but maybe they'll call him by a nickname). I wonder if we'll find our comfort in some other way. I love both Fiona and Sylvia. I don't see any connection to Shrek, maybe because Fiona has been a strong Irish name for so long (a cartoon couldn't supplant the name Mary either, for example). DH's name is Gilead, and he is Israeli. He would tell you his name comes from that region now in Jordan, not from a combination of words. Apparently in the bible it was known as a place of healing and there was some "balm of Gilead" that was supposed to be some cure-all. Usually in English his name is spelled Gilad, but either way it's pronounced the same (somewhere between gil-ODD and geel-ODD -- most Americans pronounce it the first way but his family and I pronounce it somewhere inbetween). I agree that transliterating Hebrew is tricky -- Hebrew has a bunch of letters that sound the same (the way our c/k/q can all have the same sound in a word -- can/kite/Iraq) and when converted to English those letters can lose their distinction and therefore meaning.