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Yes, I agree with all of this. Unless the Irish name is already familiar to people and/or has at least one famous namesake you can use as reference (think Siobhan) it's going to be an uphill battle. It's not a battle I would be willing to fight, nor is it one I would want to burden my child with.
Eilis is very similar & is a fantastic suggestion for something that would be less problematic. Or change the spelling to make it more intuitive for English speakers. Aylee, Ayley, etc.
If thinking about & discussing names is starting to be really unfun, my suggestion would be to stop. Take a break from names for a while-this could be a few days, a couple weeks or more, depending on when you are due. Sometimes taking a break and then coming back allows people to see things from a fresh perspective.
When you do come back to thinking/talking about names, I would suggest you quickly re-examine Joseph Dylan. It your immediate reaction at that time is positive, keep it on the table. Joseph has meaning for your family & it sounds like you have become fairly attached. Your husband's hesitation could simply be a matter of cold feet. And I really do not understand why he would think using Dylan is sychophantic. The musician will never know (and if he did, probably wouldn't care) what your son's middle name is. I wouldn't worrty too much about anyone else, especially with it tucked away safely in the middle position. Dylan is a common-enough name that people are unlikely to automatically assume it was after the musician anyway. However, if your husband still isn't sold, then perhaps this is the place for you to make suggestions. Joseph Shane is lovely, or perhaps one of your names that can't be used as a first would work as a middle instead?
If you decide to keep Joseph (with or without Dylan) on the table, but your husband is still hesitant, then I would work on coming up with a back-up name. This will allow you to head to the hospital with a couple of solid choices, and you could see what works best once baby is here. Sometimes people will continue to waffle/have cold feet no matter what the name is-and this approach might allow your husband to relax & stop 2nd guessing.
Based on the names in your post, I'll suggest Percy, Mitchell, James, Ross, Thomas, Nathaniel/Nathan, Curt/Curtis, Peter & Ryan
Personally, I would avoid matching initials for twins. So the number of L names on your lists really limits pairings I would suggest. Leighton/Lawton and Leighton/Landon seem particularly too similar to use on siblings, much less twins.
Ophelia seems really off to me with anything from your boy list. I would expect a brother to Ophelia to be named something like Sebastian or Benedict.
Lyla & Kai is the only pairing I really care for.
Girl sugggestions: Ava, Harper, Phoebe, Isla, Kyra
Boy suggestions: Owen, Finn, Jude, Aiden, Gavin, Cooper
I agree with all of this (and the flow of Jeannie Nova is fine). Doing it this way also gives you the chance to use all 4 of your favorite names at once! That's the kind of opportunity that doesn't come along very often.
Funky formatting. I actually had some spaces in there when I typed this.
I think the strength of the family connection should be considered. For example, I would keep Marie on the list, middle name of both grandmothers is a rather strong connection. However, I would probably eliminate something like Violet, as it sounds like this is just a name in your family trees, but without a direct or especially strong sentimental connection.
So, narrowing it down, I would eliminate Violet, Renee & Esther, as it sounds like the family connection isn't particularly strong with any of them.
I would probably consider names like Marie, Elise & Isabel "first tier." All of these names are found on both sides of the family, and they all have fairly direct connections (meaning it's probable you & your husband have/had reasonably close relationships with those relatives).
Eleanor, Iris & Lucy would be my "2nd tier" names. The degree of reationship to the original name holder is further than the 1st tier names, or they lost points for being found only on one side of the family. However, my tier ranking may not hold true for you. It's possible your husband had a very close relationship with his great-grandmother Eleanor-or perhaps you & your sister Elizabeth aren't especially close. Situations like that may cause a particular name to gain or lose points.
4 letters isn't a lot to go on & "goes good" with George is really very subjective. Can you give us an idea of names you like but can't use or don't meet your 4 letter requirement? This will give us an idea of the types of names you like, which will increase the quality of our suggestions for you.
With nothing else to go on, I personally think something with multiple syllables will go best with the one syllable George. However, this might limit your options if you stick to the 4 letter requirement. Some ideas: Milo, Alec, Cody, Toby, Liam, Hugo, Nico
I encourage you to keep Loretta June in the running. What your mom thinks shouldn't matter. She got to name her babies & now you get to name yours. She'll adjust to the name once it's attached to an actual baby. You've also got a nickname on hand, which should diminish any negative feelings she might have for the full name. FWIW, I love the name Loretta.
In addition to Loretta June, I'd say Alice Loretta would round out my top 2. My next favorite is Margot June .
If you really like Jane better than June, I'd encourage you to use it. Flow or rhyming between middle & last is really a non-issue in day to day life. She'll mostly be Firstname, sometimes Firstname Last-Names and occassionally Firstname Middle (for those "you-are-really-in-trouble moments). All 4 names will likely be reserved only for very formal situations, like graduations or whatnot.
I do like Ina, just not a huge fan of Ina Louise, though I could get on board with something like Ina June, Ina Jane, or perhaps Ina Margaret/Ina Margot. As for your friend, I don't think it's a huge deal. You know you aren't naming after her-and if it's not a close friend, I doubt the friend would make that assumption.
One syllable middle names for Clementine-Joy, Rose, Ruth, Tess, Bess, Maude, Pearl, Leigh. I know you want to avoid "long" A middles, but I'll add Maeve, Kate & Paige, just in case you decide to reconsider.
I agree that Ayala probably wouldn't be too diffiult for most people, at least where I live. It seems like it would fit in nicely with the "raindrop" style names talked about in this post: http://www.babynamewizard.com/archives/2013/6/raindrop-names
The name Aya is mentioned in the post, which seems like a fairly intuitive nickname for Ayala. Allie & Ala could also work.
Perhaps something that calls to mind the coloring of a deer? Sienna, Tawny, Rose, Ruby, Ginger, etc.
Or something more associated with their environment: Sylvia, Dara, Flora, Laurel?
Deer are also linked with fall/winter. It might be a bit of a reach but something evoking that time of year could maybe work. Autumn, Winter, Holly
Yes, I did wonder if the parents might be Star Trek fans. As someone who enjoys Star Trek, I would personally be pretty excited to meet a litte Tiberius. If the parents aren't fans, they may want to consider if they'll be bothered by Trekkie comments. If they don't think that will be an issue for them, I see no reason not to use it. It's a pretty awesome name even for non-fans of the show.
The people who have commented so negatively are more than rude. It's things like this that cause me to caution against sharing the names with people IRL before the baby is born. However, I will add that most people (I'm think about grandparents especially) do eventually get over hate of a name once it is attached to an actual baby. At the very least, people learn to keep their negative opinions to themselves after baby is born.
I'll second Winter as a first name.
I would personally avoid the combination of Ivy Winter, as it seems too gimmicky for me (though obviously others agree). In general, I would probably stay away from noun & adjective first names, as they could sound too descriptive with the middle name.
Flow is usually not a huge deal to me when picking first/middle, but it can be a good way to eliminate names or move them up on the list. All that said, I prefer the flow of Olivia Winter better than Livia Winter.
Other suggestions; Isla, Lydia, Naomi, Lilah, Charlotte, Lucy
There is no rule that says both parents must use the same call name for a child. You can call your son Hank, and dad can use the given name of Henry. If you like Martin but not Marty, don't call him Marty-but dad can if he wants.
Keep in mind that with any given name/nickname situation you run the risk of the child eventually choosing to go by whatever you don't call him, even if both parents are using the same call name. Because of this, you should really consider how you will feel if your child decides he prefers the call name that isn't your favorite.
I like both Henry & Hank and I really don't consider popularity to be a deal breaker. I would personally rather tell my child that I gave them the name both parents loved best vs. telling them "well, there was another name we liked better but we didn't want to look too trendy." FWIW, Henry has been on the rise since 1998, I think with nearly 20 years of increased popularity, it's got more staying power than a passing trend. Prior to 1998, it hovered around 130-140 starting about 1978, so it's never really gone away. All things considered, it's really more "timeless" as opposed to even "vintage revival."
I'm honestly pretty meh about Warner. If it's a family name for you I might be more excited about it, but otherwise it actually strikes me as more "trendy" than either of your other 2 choices. Warner itself may not be very popular, but the whole group of ending-in-er-names (especiall surnames as first) are trending right now. I suspect that, at least where I live, something like Warner would get lost among all of the names like Cooper, Carter, Archer, Dexter, Jasper, Xavier, Zander, Baxter, Miller, Ryker, Strider, etc. FWIW, I know at least one child IRL with each of these names.
I really, really like Martin for you. It actually strikes me as exactly what it seems you are looking for. It's familiar and not too "out there." It ranks 276 and has been very slowly falling for a few years. Not falling so fast or so far that it will seem out of place or "old" but certainly not at risk of seeming trendy or like a passing fad in a few years. I agree that it is an underused classic. If the only thing holding you back is the nickname Marty, refer back to the beginning of my post. :-)
As someone who was a child in the 70s, I don't think I would have blinked about Pete or Natalie. I went to school with a couple of Petes and several Natalies. Jack seems like it might be a bit off, simply that I didn't know any as a kid (though I did know several Pauls), but not so off I would have given it much thought. With Grace back then I would have assumed a more religious family (less so now) but it still wouldn't have been surprising.
I go back & forth on Gavin. I am/was familiar with Gavin McLeod & I would have recognized Gavin as a surname. Back in the day, I think I would have noticed Gavin as being unusual, but still sufficiently familliar that it wouldn't have seemed weird. Is the character American? On an American of that age, it would seem out of place to me now, but less so if they were from someplace else. I ask because Karl Urban is from New Zealand, so it's possible the character was also.
I'm with you that maybe the movie will help keep Elliot/Elliott from going girl. Probably depends on how well the movie does at the box office. Do they keep to the original story? From the trailers I've seen, it kind of looked like they didn't follow much of the original plot.
I think Mina would be a lovely namesake for Guglielmina. You could also look at other variants or names relatedd to it, just as Willa or Minna. If using the 1st initial would work, Geneva is also lovely. Other G names that could work: Gemma, Guiliana, Ginevra
Alfea just reminds this English speaker of the word alfalfa, so it's not really my favorite. But perhaps Althea as a sound-alike? Some other A names: Alea, Alannah, Adele (also similar to Odell)
You mention your FIL wants to you to name the baby after his late wife. But is that what you want? What about your husband? I think it's a lovely idea if you can find a name you like that could be considered a namesake & you both want to honor tradition, etc. But I'm not sure it's something you should do because of family pressure. Perhaps a first name you like with a middle name honoring your late MIL would be enough? Odell Mina or Odell Geneva could both work.
I love all of your old lady names, and I think Edmund is fantastic!
Other old lady names that I've always had a soft spot for include Agatha, Helen, Cordelia, Martha, Claudia & Augusta.
I'll also throw out Margaret, which really strikes me as more timeless than the others, but would still be a good fit.
OP should definitely check the regulations in her state by calling the office of vital statistics. It seems this is one of those things that varies greatly from state to state.
In the state where I had my 2nd son, birth certificates had to be filed by the hospital before the baby was released (midwives had to file within 48 hours after delivery for home births). If a name wasn't chosen yet, the certificate would be filed as "Baby Boy/Girl Surname." Parents would then have to go through an amendment process (with associated fees) to have the original certificate changed.
In the state where my first son was born, hospitals had 5 days before they were required to file for a birth certificate, meaning it would be possible to leave the hospital without a name. Parents would just need to be sure and contact the hospital before the 5 days were up, otherwise the certificate would be issued as Baby Boy/Girl Surname. In that state, parents had up to 30 days after they received the birth certificate to request amendments to the information free of charge. After that, fees were involved for any amendments.
Oops, my bad. I read the original post as Alexandre is a family name his side was pressuring him to use. I see now you were probaby referring to his surname when you mentioned pressure to use the "family name."
I think that reduces some of the issue, as there are no family traditions involved. In that case, if you allow Alexandra now, the agreement becomes "you get your favorite for this child, and I get my favorite next time, regardless of the next chid's gender."
Though I would still argue that a clear agreement should be made that Alexandre & all variants are completely off the table for future sons (first & middle) if Alexandra or a variant is used now. I say this because I know a family where they used a feminine version of dad's chosen name on a girl, thinking it would be the last child. When they later had a surprise son, he advocated really hard to use the masculine version anyway. They ended up with 2 kids with bascially the same name. I won't share the exact names here, but it was something along the lines of dad wanted Robert, they named a girl Robin, then ended up with a son called Robert anyway.
I lean more towards Irene, with Ida as my 2nd choice.
suggestions-Alice, Lucy, Joan, Nancy, Lena, June
I don't think an extra syllable is a huge deal. This sounds more like a preference as opposed to an actual "rule." A shorter nickname for daily use could help.
Starting with the same initial as her dad & a cousin seems like a minor point. If initials are a concern, I think it is more important that she not share an initial with a sibling. For practical purposes, you won't regularly need to initial her things in order to tell them apart from the belongings of dad or her cousin (unless the cousin actually lives with you).
It's not just a name. It is a name with significance to her father & his family. I suspect Stella has more significance to you than it did to your husband. The narrative does't have to be "we wanted a boy but got a girl, so you were named Alexandra." The narrative could just as easily be "Stella got a family name from my side, and you got a family name from your dad's side." Perhaps the name would have more meaning for you if you get to pick the nickname (there are lots to pick from, I've copied & pasted a list from behind the name below) and if you get more say over the middle. I think it's fair for you to get the middle if he gets the first. Other options would be to simply move Alexandra to the middle position, or chose a variant/diminutive version of the name instead.
Taking into consideration your preference for using Alexandra on a girl over Alexandre for a boy, I do lean towards going ahead and using Alexandra for this baby. However, I think a conversation should be had about ways to compromise (middle name instead of first, variant versions, letting you have full control over the middle, etc.). I would also suggest having him run this by the family members pressuring him to use Alexandre. Some families would not be satisfied with a cross-gender namesake and it's possible he could continue to get pressure for Alexandre if you have a future boy. I would want to make certain that you and your husband are in full agreement that using Alexandra (or a variant) now absolutely rules out Alexandre (and variants) later.
CROATIAN: Sanda, Sandra, Saša
DUTCH: Alex, Sandra, Xandra
ENGLISH: Alex, Alexa, Alexina, Ali, Allie, Ally, Alyx, Lexa, Lexi, Lexie, Lexine, Lexy, Sandie, Sandra, Sandy, Sondra, Zandra
FRENCH: Sacha, Sandra, Sandrine
GERMAN: Sandra, Sascha
ITALIAN: Alessa, Sandra
MACEDONIAN: Sandra, Sashka
ROMANIAN: Sanda, Sandra
RUSSIAN: Aleksandrina, Sasha, Shura
SERBIAN: Sandra, Saša
SLOVENE: Sandra, Saša
SWEDISH: Sandra, Sassa
Assuming all middle names are equal (and none have special meaning) I prefer Jude Alistair. Jude Oliver is Ok, but I generally don't like Oliver as much as Alistair.
I don't care for Jude Donovan at all. Both names are very nice on their own, but those Ds make them run together. I can imagine him being in trouble & you needing to pull out the first/middle combination. It'd sound like you were calling out "Jew Donovan get over here right now!"